A few film tips for you all. |
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MartinW 
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Joined: 31 Mar 2008 Location: United Kingdom Points: 26722 |
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 Posted: 17 Feb 2009 at 5:55pm |
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Yeah Ive seen his debunking vids before, nice try but none of them prove anything. And how are your videos different? These videos don't prove anything but yours do.
The building would not at all topple sideways if the forces were balanced, as they are when an entire floor falls onto the one beneath.
This explains all you need to now about the pancaking collapse.
The idiocy of the Thermite theory.
The sound of a skysrubbisher falling will make a lot of noise for more than 9 seconds. You need to watch that video again, especially the first bit.
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MartinW
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Posted: 17 Feb 2009 at 6:05pm |
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You really have a thing for Icke. You admire him not me. I dont care if he wares ladies underware or eats children. Exactly, and you trust his words despite the fact he fed the idiots in society with stories about shape shifting reptiles and told everyone he was Jesus. Why do you think he did that? It wasn't for fun, it was to con people. And you openly admit that you believe the words of a con man in regard to the new world order. If he lied about shape shifting aliens and about being Jesus, doesn’t your common sense tell you that there's a very good chance he's lying about the new world order. I just think its great that he has moved on from being jesus and writing about reptiles to more serious issues. I think it's great and rather amusing that he switches from one ploy to the next and now the new world order, and people like you still believe him. Astonishing!
If you believe him, you will believe anything. If you belive Icke then it tells me all I need to know about your ability to tell the diferance between fantasty and reality. |
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kamakazi
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Joined: 02 Jun 2008 Location: sweden Points: 165 |
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Posted: 17 Feb 2009 at 6:18pm |
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Ok so we are going to exchange videos now
to prove points? Nothing you present from the government and their minions will convince me, ive seen all their excuses. And i am pretty sure that you will never even think of glancing off the path of their agenda. *sigh* No if a building of 110 stories collapses from structual failure it will not fall like it did on 9/11, it will topple over since the structure wont fail all at once in the same places. And there is crystal clear video evidence of molten steel that no amount of jetfuel and burning offices can accomplish. thermite is the most likely canidate for melting steel. Also there is no way that steel collums travel 100s of yards and impale buildings due to structual fatigue. |
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kamakazi
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Posted: 17 Feb 2009 at 6:34pm |
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hahaha dude, you really haven´t read a single thing Ive written.
I DO NOT CARE ABOUT WHAT ICKE SAYS ABOUT 9/11, IF HE SAYS ITS AN INSIDE JOB, GREAT...IF HE DOSENT, GREAT! I NEW THAT THE OFFICIAL FABLE WAS BS WAY BEFORE I EVEN HEARD OF ICKE! Is that clear enough or do I have to print it in braille writing? Well since the majority of these idiots live in the UK, does that means that evryone in the UK are idiots? I would like to think not. but that makes about as much sense as what you are saying about me being wrong and stupid for happening to share an opinion that he has. Lets just say that HE has the same opinion as I do. He got it from me ok. now you are just writing complete bs. When and where did I say anything about beliving him? Putting words in other peoples mouth is really unnecessary and low. I dont know your real age but thats not very mature behaviour man =/ |
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MartinW
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Posted: 17 Feb 2009 at 6:41pm |
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Nothing you present from the government and their minions will convince me
I know, absolute definitive proof wouldn't convince you either.
*sigh* No if a building of 110 stories collapses from structual failure it will not fall like it did on 9/11, it will topple over since the structure wont fail all at once in the same places.
have you read the link?
[quot]The mechanics of the collapse are really much more simple than conspiracy theorists would like you to believe. The heat expanded the steel in the truss in all directions. As a result they also expanded into the columns. The trusses/floor system, sagged in the middle because the columns were preventing the trusses from expanding in their direction. That led to the bowing of the exterior columns. In terms of mass, the floors were comparable to tree trunks and the columns were like branches. The floor connections of the long span floors could support a load of a couple story masses and had an energy absorbing ability of a couple hundredths of a GJ per story. The floor connections were like crepe connecting the floors to the columns. The crepe was sufficient for the structure in its static organized state but was a weak link during collapse when the structure in the region of the collapse front no longer resembled the static organized state.[/quote] it's all explained with nice images for you.
Of why not listen to this, with some nice graphics for you, explained in very easy to understand terms.
When you get between 4 and 6 floors demolished by a jet airliner, the floors above collapsing onto the structurally intact building below, will most definitely cause a pancake collapse. The huge mass falling onto the floor bellow could do nothing else. And I don't need an expert to tell me that.
thermite is the most likely canidate for melting steel.
you're not reading the links I'm giving you are you? Read, identify aspects you disagree with and counter, don't ignore.
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kamakazi
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Posted: 17 Feb 2009 at 6:50pm |
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Yes if there were a shred of proof that made sense.
Yes ive read some of what you have found from the government. And it does not answer any of the questions that I have. Im not going to rewrite the questions. Even the some of the guys who designed and built the towers said that a plane crashing in to the towers would be like a a pencil being stuck in to a screen door. And that they designed them to withstand 707´s, multiple hits infact. Watch all these videos and presentations. Since you are already in denial they will convince you as little as I will be convinced by your government vids. I dont trust convicted mass murderers. http://www.ae911truth.org/twintowers.php |
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MartinW
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Joined: 31 Mar 2008 Location: United Kingdom Points: 26722 |
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Posted: 17 Feb 2009 at 6:52pm |
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When and where did I say anything about beliving him? Sorry MAN, are you saying his definition of the new world order is not yours? If it is, and as you said above you 'love Mr Icke and his theories', then what does that say about your choice of individuals to admire? Do you believe what he says about the new world order? When and where did I say anything about beliving him? You said...
Icke has really matured and gotten serious about the real world facts concerning the global elite and corruption.
So you love Mr Icke and say he’s got serious with the global corruption stuff, hence, that implies you believe him.
Read my links, listen to the audio, and come back with specific counter arguments. Other wise it's pointless. |
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MartinW
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Posted: 17 Feb 2009 at 6:54pm |
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And it does not answer any of the questions that I have.
Come on then, tell us which questions are unanswered, perhaps we can enlighten you. Specifics please.
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roachy
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Joined: 03 May 2008 Location: London Points: 1038 |
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Posted: 17 Feb 2009 at 7:05pm |
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Kamakazi, you said "And that they designed them to withstand 707´s, multiple hits infact" I find this pretty hard to believe considering that commercial aircraft that size have a velocity of at least 50m/s and mass of 150,000kg and upwards... this acts as a momentum force of 7,500,000kgm/s. And that would be over an area of perhaps 75 square metres at most... That's 100,000kgm/s per square metre. I very much doubt the supporting construction of those towers could support such forces.
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Luke Roach
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MartinW
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Posted: 17 Feb 2009 at 7:07pm |
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Well said Luke!
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kamakazi
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Posted: 17 Feb 2009 at 7:14pm |
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Yeah I love icke cause he is really entertaining, I love alternative history.
That does not mean I belive in his theories about shapeshifters or him being Jesus christ. And yes I think its great that he has matured and is now researching real issues that have a basis in truth. My definition of the global elite comes from their own documentation and actions and from history. |
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roachy
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Posted: 17 Feb 2009 at 7:23pm |
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Thanks And I do believe that Martyn's picture at the end of page 1 of this thread sums the whole thing up! thermite is the most likely canidate for melting steel Hmmmmmm.... Thermite (assuming you mean the widely used definition of Aluminium and ferrous-oxide) does indeed get pretty warm during the displacement reaction... but it's a "chemistry-set" type of material: conspiracy theorists could quite easily pick up a little wikipedia knowledge on the substance and think "it can melt steel, we can pin the blame on this". And even the most simple suggestion can pick a flaw in your suggestion that the building should topple sideways - modern skysrubbishers are designed with beams in a perpendicular truss-shape (ie lost of cubes all attatched to each other, where the vertices are the beams). This allows for stress to be distributed fairly evenly throughout the structure. And if there is a great enough stress to collapse part of the structure, as the stresses are spread evenly it should collapse the whole structure... which would lead to the cascading collapse as seen. |
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Luke Roach
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roachy
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Posted: 17 Feb 2009 at 7:25pm |
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For some reason I can't edit my post... and some text got cut...
The word "skyrubbishers" should be "skysrubbishers" but I cut and pasted words in the wrong place... sorry about that
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Luke Roach
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kamakazi
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Posted: 17 Feb 2009 at 7:39pm |
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Sure.
* Why has there never been an indipendant investigation of 9/11? Only a government funded one on a shoestring budget? The greatest crime in US history got app. 3 million dollars while the investigation of Clintons sex scandal got at least 10 times more(Im not sure of the exact sums on these). * Why was the crime scene whisked away without any investigation? * Why did the vice president gain complete control over NORAD a month before the attacks? * Why is there just a tiny hole in the pentagon where a 757 crashed in to it and no debrie from a 757 visible on the lawn or in the impact hole. And no bodies. *It is standard practice since the 50´s to intercept and then shot down aircraft who do not respond and who invade restricted airspace. No aircraft intercepted any of the planes on 9/11. not even after the first tower was hit. * Why did building 7 collapse from minimal controlable fires? * Why does Larry silverstein say that they decided to demolish building 7 when such a demolishon takes weeks to prepare? * Why did dozens of experienced firefighters, police and others claim to have heard loud explosions right before and during the collpses of the towers? * How could these hijackers fly real passanger aircraft when they could hardly master a cessna and had never even been in a 757/767 cockpit? * Why is Osama bin laden not a suspect for the attacks according to the FBI and CIA when he is the posterchild behind the attacks in the mainstream media? * Why were both towers pulverized with no recognizable structures left at all if they simply collapsed due to structural failure. What are the odds that three skysrubbishers for the first time in history collapse due to fire and all three fall in to their own foot print without toppling over at all like any other building? * And most importantly of all questions imo, On 9/11 AND 7/7 the intelligence comunity and military held exercises involving the exact same locations, the same scenarios at the same time. According to software used by incurance companies the likelyhood of all these paramaters coinsiding are something like a billion to 1. I have heard some feeble attempts by government appologists to answer these questions but they are so lame and weak that its laughable. I hope you guys can do better, i would be quite happy. |
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kamakazi
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Posted: 17 Feb 2009 at 7:48pm |
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Well Luke according to the designers of the towers they were built to withstand multiple hits from 707´s. look up the interview for your self.
As far as I know thermite is used for demolition and the towers were clearly demolished. And not being a structual engineer or architekt myself, I´ll trust the real engineers who have the nads to question the official fable and not you. I think I mispelled a few more words in the last two posts so you can use them to throw cheap punches at me and maybe make a more fortified attempt to amuse your freinds on my behalf. |
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kamakazi
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Posted: 17 Feb 2009 at 7:57pm |
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Here is a 2 hour presentation that none of you will watch.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-4617650616903609314 |
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roachy
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Joined: 03 May 2008 Location: London Points: 1038 |
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Posted: 17 Feb 2009 at 8:08pm |
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"* Why did dozens of experienced firefighters, police and others claim to have heard loud explosions right before and during the collpses of the towers?"
I do believe that when hundreds of tons of steel and conrete crack and break very loud noises will occur. But certainly not explosions.
"* How could these hijackers fly real passanger aircraft when they could hardly master a cessna and had never even been in a 757/767 cockpit?"
As a 5 year old I learned how to fly a 737 using FS98. It's not that hard to learn the basics. Aircraft are designed to be as easy as possible to fly in order to reduce pilot workload. "*It is standard practice since the 50´s to intercept and then shot down aircraft who do not respond and who invade restricted airspace. No aircraft intercepted any of the planes on 9/11. not even after the first tower was hit"
Despite being the world's best equipped, the USAF have terrible scramble times. I've read that in one incident the Hellenic Air Force once got an F-16 in the air in six minutes from emergency warning. It's a shame the USAF aren't that good.
"* And most importantly of all questions imo, On 9/11 AND 7/7 the intelligence comunity and military held exercises involving the exact same locations, the same scenarios at the same time. According to software used by incurance companies the likelyhood of all these paramaters coinsiding are something like a billion to 1."
I'd hardly call the software accurate considering nothing of the likes of 9/11 and 7/7 had ever occured before - what data could they rely on? "* Why was the crime scene whisked away without any investigation?"
Some lunatics crashed planes full of innocent passengers into buildings full of innocent people. The buildings subsequently collapsed from the massive forces of the aircraft collion and the subsequent fires. So there really wasn't a crime scene left! |
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Luke Roach
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roachy
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Posted: 17 Feb 2009 at 8:24pm |
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The first line is "I'm so happy to be here tonight".
He doesn't sound/look it!
"I've designed numerous fireproof, steel-framed buildings in my career, including these 3 and 10 million dollar..." But nothing the size and scale of the WTC. Plus, the WTC were early 70's construction, not early 00's construction. "And find those people that are open minded enough to be able to hear the facts about these building collapses" You don't have to be open minded to accept facts, being open minded is the acceptance of opinion. "16% of Americans believe that it's likely that the collapse of the twin towers was aided by explosives secretly planted"
What about the other 84%? The majority? We're assumnig there are more aligned than misaligned people here right? "NIST never looked for it [explosives planted in the twin towers]" Well, perhaps they had more important things to do than search for explosives (which nobody saw) in a building which was just hit by a 767 (which everybody saw)
"Fire induced collapses are asymetrical... yet no steel-framed high-rise has ever collapsed from fire"
"And note that they've never occured in very large, very hot, very long lasting fires"
No other steel-frame high rise has been hit by a commercial jet carrying thousands of gallons of Jet-A.
Can't be bothered to watch any more, I'm going to watch CSI, which is probably more scientifically truthful. |
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Luke Roach
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kamakazi
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Posted: 17 Feb 2009 at 8:36pm |
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No they saw flashes and heard explosions.
Professional airline pilots have seen the flights and said there is no way. Flying a sim and flying a real aircraft is performing real manuvers is not even close. i thought it was as well until i talked to a real pilot. You are right that they are designed to take away from the workload though. They scramble in 8-10 minutes. Even if it were 10-20 minutes they still had plenty of time, but stood down and did nothing. I dont see why they could not use all the info from the real events and feed that in to their software. Ok lets forget the software. Do you honestly belive it to be pure coincidence? If so that would be the mother of all CT´s. Not a crime scen, the greatest crime in US history? Im sure that the entire law enforcement world would disagree with you on that one. |
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roachy
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Posted: 17 Feb 2009 at 8:46pm |
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"I dont see why they could not use all the info from the real events and feed that in to their software. Ok lets forget the software. Do you honestly belive it to be pure coincidence? If so that would be the mother of all CT´s."
Even if you did feed that into the software, you can't predict the probability of something's occurence from a single event!
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Luke Roach
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