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Piper Warrior SP1

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Steve 451 View Drop Down
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    Posted: 11 Aug 2017 at 7:02pm
just downloaded the update for the PA28 Warrior. It is an improvement on the original but, there are still a few issues to deal with.
The acceleration on the runway is still far to quick, and the climb out seems to quick too.
When deploying the flaps there is still not enough ballooning effect.Its really quite pronounced in the real aircraft.
The sound is also not much like the real thing.
As I have said before. The original Flying Club version was closer in my mind to the real thing, both in flight and sound.
Its my opinion, and not every one will agree. But I have flown quite a lot of hours in the Warrior.
I do however like the landing. It does remind me of the roundout and flare.
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Tutmeister View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tutmeister Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Aug 2017 at 8:04am
This is what I posed at avsim the other day:
Just had a quick circuit or two and so far it seems great! Flap lever animation is spot on now, rpm drop on mag check is much improved and it balloons upwards nicely when deploying flaps which you can compensate for nicely if you have flaps assigned to an analogue lever and lower them in a coordinated way. Have now done a few circuits and touch and goes and I'm really liking this.

Couple of minor points, I think it maybe just a tad overpowered, I added my not inconsiderable bulk to the pilots seat and felt it climbed a bit harder than I would expect using 2 stages of flaps and 65kts, I was able to hold a much steeper angle. Also the ball takes far too much rudder to keep centered on full power. I had to use so much rudder that it was starting to roll me and I had to counter with opposite yoke. This was all at 65kts and could be linked to excess engine power? As airspeed increases this reduces but I felt that full power climbs under 80kts require too much rudder and can be held too steeply.

Lastly, nice that it balloons up with the flaps but maybe once stable it is a bit nose high with the flaps down. It should lift the nose but once trimmed it should then have a nose down attitude. This is hard to tell after a quick few flights as it depends on zoom and seat position so I'm happy to admit I'm wrong with that one.

Hey I'm happy with it anyway, its great! I feel bad criticising it, I'm really just nit picking here!

Thanks Martyn and Just Flight for listening to community feedback and reacting. Good work guys! :)

Chris
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vbazillio View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote vbazillio Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Aug 2017 at 12:54pm
Originally posted by Steve 451 Steve 451 wrote:

The acceleration on the runway is still far to quick, and the climb out seems to quick too. 

Originally posted by Tutmeister Tutmeister wrote:

Couple of minor points, I think it maybe just a tad overpowered,

To illustrate. The needle goes that fast to 70 I missed the rotation speed. And I can't hardly keep 70 kts on upwind ;)


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Martyn View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Martyn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Aug 2017 at 11:30am
Thanks for the feedback. We are currently working on further improvements to the FDE.

Martyn
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apollon01 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote apollon01 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Aug 2017 at 12:38pm
Hi all,

I was putting some virtual time on the demo Warrior II yesterday (I am planning to buy the product) and could, for your interest and possible thoughts, note the following:

- Beautiful visuals - wear and tear, scratches on the windshield... really nice

- I can only second to what has been already said about the "overpowering".

- I think the turning radius when taxying is rather tight. The real aircraft does not turn so quickly.

- After applying full throttle I was taken by surprise how much left turning tendency there was. The real aircraft is actually pretty docile once the throttle is firewalled. It does need right rudder to compensate but certainly not so much. Maybe too much torque on the model?

- At first the model was always banking left. Only the pilot and the tanks both full were simulated. The rudder trim did not get that right. The model was still banking left even after I added a co-pilot with the same weight as the pilot. Weird... I recall the demo Arrow III did the same. Once I removed some fuel from the left tank, the model started to bank right rather a lot. That should be a natural tendency of an imbalanced aircraft but to my experience the left/right banking tendencies are rather overdone.

- I spent quite some time behind a real 160hp Lycoming and unfortunately I have to say the Warrior II model does not capture the engine sound that well. I recall that the original Flying Club Warrior got the engine sound just right


I fly the Warrior and the Cadet in real world so it is also a real life experience talking here. Give please a thought to the comments above. I think your Warrior II is definitely worth it as it is already a pretty good add-on!

Regards,

Milan
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Delta558 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Delta558 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Aug 2017 at 4:53pm
I'll give you some thoughts on the fde points you raise:

1) Overpowering - sorted, files ready for SP2. Should now take 15-18 seconds to Vr dependant on weight, surface etc. Climbout will also be a lot less 'sporty'LOL

2) Turning radius - the angle of nosewheel steering is set as per the real world aircraft. Not sure why it's too tight for you, it's not been mentioned before but if it's a problem it's a really simple fix.

3) The left yaw with throttle - this has been a constant argument through the entire PA28 series, to the point where I actually had two Arrow instructors telling me different things at the same time: One said there was too little, the other too much. It's not something I'm going to change because the current setting is 'right' for a Warrior instructor, less than others have wanted it but obviously too much for you so it's sort of a middle ground! Again, there is a very simple fix.

4) I've put a vid in one of the other threads showing how little left bank I actually get in the sim with no rudder trim, and with rudder trim I do not need any aileron input. Again, as I have alluded to elsewhere, the 'feel' in sim is totally different to the feel in real aircraft because with sim controllers (joysticks, pedals etc) you have a solid centre point which you have to apply force to 'break' the axis out of, and if slightly off-centre are always applying force against the controller's desire to return to perfect centre. That is not the case with aircraft, and I wonder when was the last time anyone checked that their yoke / stick was perfectly in the centre while the aircraft was straight and level. I know I never have! Real-world, it is so much easier to just 'ride out' any minor deviations with a slight nudge in the right direction that you often don't actually feel it as it is so instinctive. Every one of those times in sim, you have to make a conscious movement and always feel the break point.

Anyway, those are some thoughts and I hope they make sense to you. For the 'simple fixes', feel free to drop me a PM.

Cheers,
Paul.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote apollon01 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Aug 2017 at 8:27pm
Hi Paul,

Thanks for a quick answer!

I just bought the Warrior II and the Arrow III.

ad 1) OK, great. I am looking forward to the SP2.

ad 2) Fine, I can live with that

ad 3) OK.

ad 4) Good point. I have not realized this. The true is that in real Warrior the minor movements around the "null zone" of the yoke are very light.


After some more flying around I have one more comment:
After engine start, the fuel pressure gauge is always showing max reading - no matter whether the fuel pump is on or off. The screens in the manual show actually the same situation.

Thanks for a great product!

Regards,

Milan
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Delta558 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Delta558 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Aug 2017 at 8:44pm
Hi Milan,

We're aware of the fuel pressure, should also get sorted in SP2.

On No 4, yes - very light movements but that does not come as easy in the sim. For example; with no trim, keeping the wings level needs me to put my stick just on the edge of the central detent. No further or it's turning the other way. It's an effort to keep it there because it's like a ridge around the centre but if there were no centring springs it would be a negligible movement. Frustrating!

Cheers,
Paul.
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Tutmeister View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tutmeister Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Sep 2017 at 9:02am
Great news! That covers pretty much everything I noticed although I still have issue with how it sideslips, or doesn't very well. I can live with it but in a perfect world it would. I hate comparisons (and yet I seem to be making them all the time!, I guess I feel guilty comparing other people's work) but the a2a Cherokee slips more like the real warrior than this does.

Can you all do me a favour though and check your egt? Mine doesn't seem to move!
Chris
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