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FabioL View Drop Down
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    Posted: 03 May 2013 at 11:08am
Hi,
Would you please consider changing the name or flight number of military traffic which is at present "0" (ZERO)?
It somehow sounds wrong to hear "Zero, turn left onto....", as this call sign is unlikely in the RW.
Alternatively, please could you indicate where I can change this aircraft's flight number (which aircraft.cfg it is)?
Thanks,
Fabio
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote freddy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 May 2013 at 6:01am
This happens with aircraft that don't have a FLIGHT NUMBER associated with them in the flight plans. In other words, it is not just military planes.

FSX ATC uses a set of predetermined programmed rules to decide whether and when it should call out the airline name, the flight number, the aircraft registration/tail number, the aircraft type, etc etc. And, depending on a few different factors, it works out what it is going to say by drawing on the details from EITHER the aircraft.cfg files, OR, from within the compiled flight plans ... OR, in some cases, from BOTH.

Sadly, that means that you will not resolve this issue simply by making some changes in the relevant aircraft.cfg files.

The true problem here lies in the fact that NOT ALL PLANES IN JUST FLIGHT'S FLIGHT PLANS HAVE BEEN ASSIGNED A FLIGHT NUMBER. You can see this by opening Traffic 360 and looking at various flight plans - many of them will NOT have flight numbers. So the compiled Traffic 360 AI traffic file is the real issue here.

An example to illustrate:

A Cessna AI plane from Traffic 360, is flying in Flight Simulator. Depending on the FSX predetermined programmed rules for AI and ATC, and on a few other factors, the FSX ATC code determines that it needs to call out the FLIGHT NUMBER for this Cessna AI plane. But, this particular AI flight in Just Flight's flight plans has not been assigned a flight number. So FSX ATC says the word "zero".

The fix for this is to go in and assign flight numbers for each and every AI plane in Traffic 360, followed by a recompile of the AI traffic file. I realise this might be easier said than done ... but, that's the way to fix it.

For the record, it was the same with Traffic X too. I spent AGES fixing this issue in Traffic X, followed by a recompile. Unfortunately for me, I did the work on that long before I learnt that I could open and edit the appropriate traffic files (take backups FIRST) in programs like Notepad++, or Microsoft Excel, and use the SEARCH AND REPLACE tools to make the required changes much more quicker and far more easily than I could do using the Traffic X interface (hint, hint, hehehe). (But instructions, help, and guidance on how to do the task using programs like that is pretty much beyond anything that could easily be posted here.) Just remember, if you experiment with this idea/method, TAKE BACKUPS OF YOUR TRAFFIC 360 FILES AND FOLDERS FIRST.

A "better" solution would be for Just Flight to fix this, once and for all, by adding flight numbers for all flights ... and releasing that with the forthcoming Service Pack.   
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FabioL Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 May 2013 at 8:17am
Hi Freddy,
Many thanks for your very comprehensive answer; it's clear you have toiled with this issue for some time!
How would you search for flights without a flight number, as a search for "ATC_flight_number=" would brings up all flights, those with and those without, and is missing airline names a factor in this? I use Agent Ransack.
I would hope that JF updates the product with appropriate airline names and flight numbers too.
Thanks,
Fabio
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote freddy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 May 2013 at 12:44pm
The text "ATC_flight_number=" would be found in aircraft.cfg files. That text won't be found in the flight plans. And, because the problem lies in the flight plans, searching for that text won't be of any help.

Sadly, it is a long time ago that I worked on this, and therefore my memory on exactly how I resolved it is a little bit hazy.

Suffice to say, you need to search inside the FLIGHT PLANS to make sure that each and every flight has a flight number associated with it (that is to say, a number which is not "0"). As I said, my memory is a bit hazy on it, but I vaguely recall that the issue occurs only for VFR flights (or was it the other way around, only IFR flights?). I seem to remember that the issue did not apply to AIRLINES because they ALL had flight numbers already. So I think it was only the GA flights and business flights which were affected (and, yes, the military flights). From memory, as I looked around at the flight plans in Traffic X, I began to notice that there was a pattern to this and it was always going to be "this kind" of flight, or "that kind" of flight in the flight plans. Having noticed there was a pattern, it then became easier to search and find the "problem" flight plans and thus correct them (by assigning a flight number to them).

Again I stress that my memory on this is quite hazy. But I think what I've written in the above paragraph is something along the lines of how I did it. I do know that the issue is definitely caused by flights not having a flight number associated with them. And I do know that once you add flight numbers and recompile the AI traffic file, the problem goes away (it has for me in my FSX). I also know that I spent A DAMN LOT of time in the Traffic X interface adding flight numbers to fix the problem. Thankfully, the good news is that there's no need to edit every single individual flight plan ... there's literally hundreds (thousands?) of those. That would have been way too time consuming; and I know I didn't need to do that.

In summary ... This issue is not related to the "ATC_flight_number=" line in the aircraft.cfg files. It is to do with the compiled Traffic 360 AI flight plans. Have a look at the flight plans in Traffic 360, find a few that have "zero" for a flight number, and see if you can work out a pattern (always VFR?, always IFR?, just GA?, only GA VFR flights?, only business IFR flights?). You may even need to run Flight Simulator a few times and listen to ATC to try to work out which planes it is happening to and then seeing if you can find those planes in the flight plans in Traffic 360. From there, once you discover a pattern of some kind, you can hopefully work out the best and most efficient way/method to search for the problem flight plans in Traffic 360 and then enter flight numbers for them to correct the issue (and of course don't forget to recompile of the AI traffic file after making the changes).

In response to the question whether missing airline names could be a factor in this ... yes, that is a possibility. If ATC does not have an airline name to say, then it will say only the flight number. Note we are talking about the flight number that is compiled inside the AI traffic file from the flight plans; which is NOT the flight number from the aircraft.cfg file. If ATC has no airline name to say, AND the flight does not have a flight number in the compiled AI traffic file, then ATC will say "zero". Note that if ATC *DOES* have an airline name to say, but the flight number is zero, then you will hear "Virgin 0" or "American 0". And, because you do not hear that, I'd be reasonably confident that all the airline flights *DO* have flight numbers in Traffic 360. I am still using Traffic X (I do not have Traffic 360), and, as I said above, the flight number issue was NOT an issue for the airline flights in Traffic X because they ALL had flight numbers already. I'd expect that Traffic 360 would be the same.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Soaranden Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 May 2013 at 11:51pm
I have something that may be helpful with regard to flight numbers. Freddy, as I recall (and my recollection may be incorrect), you told me that you were using Excel. I have both Microsoft Office and the free LibreOffice. I used LibreOffice Calc in the image below.

I no longer have any Traffic X flight plans that don't have flight numbers, but I can show how a Traffic X tab-delimited flight plan tcc file with flight numbers looks in a spreadsheet. (Yes, I know, this is the Traffic 360 forum, but I still use Traffic X). In the below spreadsheet, column "H" contains the flight numbers. Using a spreadsheet, therefore, it should be pretty easy to determine which flight plans do not contain flight numbers. I would think that if you have a flight plan tcc file that contains no flight numbers (and perhaps no column for them) whatsoever, you could insert a column (in the same position as the column that shows flight plans as seen below) and add flight numbers directly to the flight plan tcc file. Of course, if some of the flight plans showing in a spreadsheet already have flight numbers showning in the column, then it would be a simple matter to add flight numbers to the cells where no flight numbers exist. (You may notice that I still have some work to do, myself, since not all of the flight plans shown have unique flight numbers).


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote freddy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 May 2013 at 12:04am
Yes, you are correct, I did use Excel as part of this task. In fact, I recall using BOTH (Traffic X *AND* Excel at the same time).

I am personally reluctant to try to explain HOW to use Excel (or Notepad++ etc) to do this kind of work. Without a good knowledge of which files to look in, how to get around in those files, and where exactly to look etc, it can lead to disaster. In my posts I did "hint"/"suggest" that the work can be done using these kinds of programs. And, of course, I have also warned in my posts that BACKUPS SHOULD BE TAKEN before doing any work. In my last post, I was careful to choose my words by saying "you can hopefully work out the best and most efficient way/method to search for the problem flight plans in Traffic 360 and then enter flight numbers for them to correct the issue".

Bottom line, I am not trying here to be mean or unhelpful ... far from it. I want to help. It's just that I don't want to get myself embroiled in any long-winded instructional explanations about how to open and edit the files using external programs such as Excel or Notepad++. I fear such a discussion will get very difficult to explain, and can lead to MAJOR issues for someone if they make a mistake etc. Not to mention that people have varying levels of knowledge and skill when it comes to Windows, and programs like Excel etc. It's just a path that I personally prefer not to go down. Although I am happy to "hint" that it can be done.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FabioL Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 May 2013 at 7:42am
Hi Soaranden and Freddy,
I am really appreciative for your help, especially with respect to Excel and delimited file types; no worries there, I'm an Excel expert (a while ago that is - MCP V5.0!!!). I used to write basic VB for work to grab data about call management for service level stats etc.
Now I understand this routine, there'll be no end to me tailoring T360.
Thank you again,
Fabio
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote freddy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 May 2013 at 8:54am
Ahhh. MCP hey? Knowledge of Excel huh? In that case, go for it. I am the senior customer service person at an IT company, and I have plenty of experience with how difficult it can be trying to explain stuff like this to people with varying levels of skill and knowledge. Hence, my reluctance to do so here. But it sounds like you will be fine. Dan's screenshot should get you started. You can edit most (not all) of the Traffic 360 files using any program that will do ASCII edits (such as Notepad, Notepad++ [better], Excel, etc). Remember, as always, to take BACKUPS before doing anything ... and, remember that you must recompile the AI traffic file after making all the edits that you want to make.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FabioL Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 May 2013 at 9:09am
No worries, and thanks!
I've been in computing since before the IBM PC XT, before the age of Apricots, Osbornes, Sirius, Rainbow etc, even before CPM and Basic, when we had five-man teams to carry a single plastic CDC disc cartridge unit with 5Mb capacity (!), optical discs were 8", and engineers (err, me!) had to carry 8" floppy's 246K, oscilloscopes, toolkits, soldering irons, solder suckers etc.
You could always distinguish an engineer in those days - we wore tie clips to stop our ties being eaten by pulley wheels, gears, and cogs, in the day of fixable photo electric cells, and HD heads that we polished with alcohol before fitting and aligning them with square form wave or cats eye patterns.
Those were the days....
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote freddy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 May 2013 at 9:54am
Hehehe, the first computer I ever used only had an 8-digit display, similar to an extremely large calculator.

Ahh yes, I know what you're talking about. The first computer program I ever wrote was done by using a pencil to color in on special cards. The cards were then scanned and punched by a machine. Hundreds of punch cards were required to write only a handful of lines of code. Feed the cards in to the special reader, and thus the computer program was entered. CPM was a dream compared to that. 8 inch floppy disks, cassette tapes to load programs, acoustic coupler modems at 75 baud, and my first word processor: WordStar. Not to mention Lunar Lander and this pretty damn cool Flight Simulator program, both on the school's Apple II. Those were indeed the days.

I have fond memories of being connected to this thing called the "Internet", LONG BEFORE anyone else had even heard of it, using a coupler modem, and typing UNIX COMMANDS on a COMMAND LINE (no WWW back then) to download pictures of the moon directly from NASA. It took over two hours just to get a grainy, fairly small, black and white image. But my friend and I sat there, for the entire duration, simply fixated, staring at the monitor, and watching every line get drawn pixel by pixel, one after the other. We were getting this image, over the telephone line, through this strange coupler device thing, all the way from AMERICA, and we weren't even paying overseas dialing charges! I cannot even begin to describe how EXCITING that was! I even remember a time when it was VERY MUCH frowned upon if you tried to ADVERTISE or SELL something on the "Internet". Oh how you got "yelled at" on mIRC by the other folks who were lucky enough to have online connections back then. (I am sure today's Twitter is really just a slightly improved version of mIRC? Yes? My how things come full circle.)

Still, you sound like you've seen and done far more than I have. I lost my programming skills years ago (programming never really grabbed me). But I never lost my interest in being a user. These days I do IT customer support and software interface design. There's a little bit of programming on the side (scripting really; I write installers). I'm surrounded by computers and programmers. And what do I do when I come home from work? I sit at a computer and do flight sim stuff (which includes not only flying, but also working constantly on the AI stuff in my sim, as well as writing and editing XML code to fix and improve the gauges in my aircraft, etc, etc). Hehe, you'd think I'd be sick of computers after being at it all day at work ... so the last thing I'd want to do is come home and do it ... but, no, I love it.

But, we digress.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RayM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 May 2013 at 6:01pm
VFR vs IFR and flight numbers.

I am coming in to this discussion a bit late I know but here goes.

If you use AIFPC to make up flightplans manually, the rule is, if a flight is VFR, then a code letter 'R' and a code '0' (zero) go into the flightplan data whereas if a flight is IFR then a code letter 'F' and a code 'xxx' (where xxx is the flight number) go into the data. I always use AIFPC when there is a particular flightplan that I want to see ALL of the time and is not affected by the random percentage value that is generated by the Traffic X compiler every time you use it.

AC#4010,HB-KET,30%,24h,VFR,10:38,11:08,29,R,0,LSGN,14:38,15:08,29,R,0,LSGN
AC#1881,1214,20%,24h,IFR,00:33,00:55,220,F,184,LSMM,07:00,07:22,230,F,184,LSGS

Note the 'VFR' / 'R,0' and 'IFR' / 'F,184' bits in these 2 lines of code (don't worry too much about the rest for now).
The 1st aircraft will not ask for IFR clearance before it starts up its engines and ATC will refer to it by its registration HB-KET.
The 2nd aircraft will ask for IFR clearance before starting its engines and ATC will refer to it by its flight number.
I BELIEVE THIS IS THE WAY THINGS SHOULD BE IN FLIGHT SIMULATOR AS IN THE REAL WORLD.

One of the many problems with Traffic X (and I suspect Traffic 360 will be the same) is that when the flightplans are compiled, irrespective of whether you have entered VFR or IFR in the appropriate box, all of the compiled flightplans contain the 'F' coding and none have an 'R' code! This can be discovered by reverse engineering a Traffic X / 360 '.bgl' file using AIFPC when you will discover the above discrepancy.

Perhaps if Just Flight could sort this out they could also make the compiler accept the registration letters that users put into the flightplans rather than churn out all aircraft in the same flightplan set with the identical registration!!!
I hope this helps the discussion.

Ray
A long time FSXA and Traffic X user
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote freddy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 May 2013 at 10:28pm
Good to have your input Ray. Hmmm, intriguing.

Traffic X (and therefore I will assume Traffic 360) use the tools and utilities from Microsoft's TRAFFIC TOOLBOX to create and compile the flight plans. The file SCHEDULES.DAT is created by the Traffic X program (and, again, I assume Traffic 360) which is then used to compile the AI traffic file.

Interestingly, the SCHEDULES.DAT file does not contain any 'R' code or 'F' code in it. And Microsoft make no mention of an 'R' code and an 'F' code in their SDK and respective documentation which explains the various TRAFFIC TOOLBOX files, tools and utilities (link provided below). It therefore looks like the 'R' and 'F' codes are native only to the AIFPC program, and I'd guess they are therefore used by that program somehow just for its own coded internal purpose.

Here is a snippet taken from my SCHEDULES.DAT file showing two flights ... a daily scheduled IFR flight and a daily scheduled VFR flight. Note there's no 'R' code or 'F' code.


AC1113,083,20,ONE_DAY,VFR
{
2115,YBTL,250,83
0135,YPDN,250,83
0555,YBTL,250,83
1015,YPDN,250,83
}

AC1172,089,20,ONE_DAY,IFR
{
0030,YWLM,250,89
1235,YPDN,250,89
}


Information on the TRAFFIC TOOLBOX set of tools, including details on the syntax and structure of the SCHEDULES.DAT file, can be found here: Micorosoft ESP TRAFFIC TOOLBOX

Hint 1: It is possible to use Traffic X to create and modify flight plans (and respective files) for you, and then use ASCII based utilities such as Notepad to edit the files that get created. With an understanding of aircraft.cfg files, as well as a knowledge of the syntax and structure of the AI files which get generated by Traffic X, you can make appropriate edits to ensure you see individual flight plans you want to see ALL of the time, you can "fix" the random percentage value that is generated by the Traffic compiler every time you use it, you can fix tail registration numbers, you can configure things so that aircraft don't ask for IFR clearance before they start up their engines with ATC referring to them only by their respective tail registrations, or you can get aircraft to ask for IFR clearance before starting engines with ATC referring to them by the flight number.

This is how I use the Traffic X program ... first, get it to make or modify the files (which, depending on requirements, may or may not include getting Traffic X to do a compile so that appropriate entries get added to files such as SCHEDULES.DAT), then I edit the files, lastly followed by me MANUALLY compiling the AI traffic using the "_COMPILE.BAT" file found in the Traffic X "Compiler" folder (I do not compile them from within the Traffic X program because that would "undo" the file edits I've made). And, of course, ALWAYS MAKE BACKUPS before modifying and manipulating files.

Hint 2: Yes, you may observe that the aircraft tail registrations shown in that snippet of my SCHEDULES.DAT file above are indeed numbers as opposed to letters. The two flights shown are military flights and I've given them numbers as registrations, which incidentally match their flight number, on purpose.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RayM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 May 2013 at 9:04am
Freddy,

I hear (see) what you say about using the SDK methods but, as far as I am concerned, the AIFPC technique is much more user friendly and allows more flexibility. For example, if you wanted to write a plan for one aircraft that consisted of a mixture of VFR and IFR sections, then using SDK you would need to write separate sections whereas AIFPC allows for this by the inclusion of the R and F codes. This may be something that the originator of Ttools (Lee?) added when he originally came up with these handy tools. I suspect the SDK compiler automatically creates inherent R and F codes without actually mentioning them. I haven't tried the SDK method but will do a test and see how it works.

Re: Hint 1 - yes this what I do in my own way. Use Traffic X to create flightplans (remember that Traffic X works in 'local times'), decompile using AIFPC (times are now in UTC) and then edit (I use Excel) to 'correct' any anomalies. Finally I recompile using AIFPC.
Re: Hint 2 - I have never understood why Traffic X asks you for an aircraft registration which it then completely ignores. Is it because, as I suspect, that all flights are considered as IFR types, in which case they think that the registration is not required, with ATC calling each aircraft by its flight number which does get included in the .bgl.

Ray
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote freddy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 May 2013 at 7:15am
Originally posted by RayM RayM wrote:

I hear (see) what you say about using the SDK methods but, as far as I am concerned, the AIFPC technique is much more user friendly and allows more flexibility.

Of that I have no doubt. The way I am doing it can be slow and frustrating, and you need to keep your wits about you. For me though, it's all I know because I was someone who really only got started with AI using the SDK methods. And I've not attempted the TTools way purely because FSX uses the SDK method by default, so I'll stick with it. Thankfully, I've become reasonably good at it and I'm quite comfortable with it now.


Originally posted by RayM RayM wrote:

For example, if you wanted to write a plan for one aircraft that consisted of a mixture of VFR and IFR sections, then using SDK you would need to write separate sections whereas AIFPC allows for this by the inclusion of the R and F codes. This may be something that the originator of Ttools (Lee?) added when he originally came up with these handy tools. I suspect the SDK compiler automatically creates inherent R and F codes without actually mentioning them. I haven't tried the SDK method but will do a test and see how it works.

Hmmm. You could be right.   It may indeed create inherent R and F codes without actually mentioning them. Although that said, it is my understanding that Microsoft (Aces) rewrote a lot of the AI code and a new SDK for the latest version of the sim (FSX). TTools was the "old" way of doing things (FS2004 and earlier). The "new" way uses the TrafficDatabaseBuilder.exe and takes the syntax and structure mentioned in the Microsoft ESP TRAFFIC TOOLBOX documentation/SDK. I'm not all fully up with the details and history of it ... but, perhaps the rewrite of the AI stuff that was done meant that they did away with the R and F codes. However, given that it is still possible to use TTools to create AI traffic files, and given that R and F codes are used for that, AND it all still works in FSX, I really have no idea.


Originally posted by RayM RayM wrote:

Re: Hint 1 - yes this what I do in my own way. Use Traffic X to create flightplans (remember that Traffic X works in 'local times'), decompile using AIFPC (times are now in UTC) and then edit (I use Excel) to 'correct' any anomalies. Finally I recompile using AIFPC.

Hehehe. And I suspect that there are other people out there who, like us, do it this way as well (use the Traffic X or Traffic 360 program to create files, but then manually edit those files before manually doing their compile).


Originally posted by RayM RayM wrote:

Re: Hint 2 - I have never understood why Traffic X asks you for an aircraft registration which it then completely ignores. Is it because, as I suspect, that all flights are considered as IFR types, in which case they think that the registration is not required, with ATC calling each aircraft by its flight number which does get included in the .bgl.

I too have no idea why they ask for a registration which they seemingly do not use. Well, it does kind of get used, just not correctly. THIS is probably the very crux of the original post. Depending on the flight setup, the registration may or may NOT be used by the ATC in the sim. And, when the registration is not used, the flight number (generally) is. Therefore, because Just Flight have not provided flight numbers for some flights, the result is that ATC ends up calling out "zero".
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RayM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 May 2013 at 6:19pm
Freddy,

there you are then - I think this topic has gone full circle!

I am in the middle of doing experimental plans using Traffic X and seeing what actually happens re VFR and IFR with and without flight numbers - this is a bit of a mess when you put it into FSX. I am going to repeat the same plans using AIFPC to see what FSX does then.
If the results look interesting, I will post here later.

Ray
A long time FSXA and Traffic X user
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote freddy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 May 2013 at 12:41am
Originally posted by RayM RayM wrote:

there you are then - I think this topic has gone full circle!

I was thinking the same thing.

Originally posted by RayM RayM wrote:

I am in the middle of doing experimental plans using Traffic X and seeing what actually happens re VFR and IFR with and without flight numbers - this is a bit of a mess when you put it into FSX. I am going to repeat the same plans using AIFPC to see what FSX does then. If the results look interesting, I will post here later.

Careful, (he says sarcastically), that's the way I started the journey toward trying to understand all things AI - experimentation and testing. But it's a lot of fun.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RayM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 May 2013 at 2:04pm
I won't guarantee that my test results are totally conclusive, but, after 'exhaustive' testing, I have to say that when picking 'VFR' or 'IFR' for flightplans when programming in Traffic X (I assume the same is happening in 360), what you get depends on the existence of an entry "ATC_Airline=xxxxx" in the chosen aircraft's 'aircraft.cfg' file. (I do not think the "ATC_ID=" value plays any part in this.)

If there is no entry (or is blank after the equals sign) and you program VFR then the aircraft behaves for VFR i.e. starts engine, requests departure and uses registration for ident. It will do this even if there is a flight no. programmed. If you program IFR, the a/c will request IFR clearance, start engine and request taxi - it will still use the registration for ident.
If there is an entry (which will be an airline ATC name, Air Force or such like) and you program VFR, but with a flight number as 0 (zero), the a/c will behave as a VFR i.e. starts engine and requests departure. But it will use 0 (zero) as its ident. If you do program a flight number, it will use that as ident.
If there is an entry (which will be an airline ATC name, Air Force or such like) and you program IFR, but with a flight number as 0 (zero), the a/c will behave as a IFR, the a/c will request IFR clearance, start engine and request taxi - it will use 0 as the flight number. If you do program a flight number, it will then use that as ident.

Be aware that, because the ATC_airline= entry exists for each variation of aircraft, you can, if you are the same as me, have some variations within one aircraft type that have entries and some that do not (e.g. default Cessna 208), which may throw this system into confusion if you allow Traffic X (or 360) to pick aircraft out for you by selecting in the "Aircraft Type" field and not a specific aircraft by selecting in the "Aircraft" field. But nothing is perfect is it?

Hope this helps anyone who is still listening.

Ray

A long time FSXA and Traffic X user
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FabioL View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FabioL Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 May 2013 at 2:14pm
Hi,
Yes, many thanks, this is most useful.
I'm hoping that JF are also listening in on this, as this is an area that needs addressing in the SP.
Thanks again,
Fabio
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote freddy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 May 2013 at 8:20am
Nice work RayM. You will notice that the word "airline" is in the "ATC_airline=" entry. In FSX, airlines use flight numbers, and ATC will call the airline name (if it can match it in its ATC database) AND the flight number. Having something in the "ATC_airline=" field indicates to FSX that this aircraft is part on an airline (and thus its flight number should be used by ATC to identify it) ... regardless of whether it is VFR or IFR.

Along these lines, an issue arises when the "ATC_airline" field does have information entered, but that information does NOT match the airline names in the ATC database. In this case ATC will call only the flight number. And, if that is 0, then you will only hear ATC call "ZERO".

Further, if the name entered in to that field DOES match the airline names in the ATC database, AND the flight number is 0, then ATC will call the airline name followed by the flight number, "zero" ... for example, "Singapore zero" or "Air Force zero".

From this, obviously, it is important to make sure anything entered in the "ATC_airline=" field DOES match the ATC database ... if you want to hear the airline name correctly called out (followed by the flight number [which you want to make sure is not 0]). Or, you can be inventive and have it NOT match the ATC database (you may, on purpose, decide you do not want to hear it call out an airline name, but wish to use this field for your own other naming convention purposes) ... but in this case, make sure you DO have a flight number that is NOT zero.

As you have noted, there are other variations that can be used and may come in to play depending on other circumstances, but the "airline" one is worth storing away in the memory banks as one works with AI.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Soaranden Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 May 2013 at 3:52pm
Originally posted by freddy freddy wrote:

Nice work RayM.


Yes, kudos to you, Ray, for doing the testing and for posting the results of your testing here.

Originally posted by freddy freddy wrote:

From this, obviously, it is important to make sure anything entered in the "ATC_airline=" filed DOES match the ATC database ... if you want to hear the airline name correctly called out (followed by the flight number (which you want to make sure is not 0)). Or, you can be inventive and have it NOT match the ATC database (you may, on purpose, decide you not want to hear it call out an airline name, but wish to use this field for your own other naming convention purposes) ... but in this case, make sure you DO have a flight number that is NOT zero.


Yes, I recently experienced an unusual (or, as you say, "inventive") use of the "atc_airline=" line. I recently downloaded some additional liveries for the FSX default Cessna 208B. (As many of you already know, nearly all of the aircraft I use for AI flights are either user aircraft that I have downloaded/purchased or user aircraft that came with FSX/Acceleration). Each of the new liveries that I downloaded for the 208B were created by the same person, and each of the new liveries included an aircraft.cfg "atc_airline=" entry that contained the aircraft's registration number rather than an airline name. (No "atc_id=" entry was present). After using Traffic X to set up some VFR flights for the new liveries and to assign flight numbers for each AI flight plan, I found ATC would call out only the flight number that I had assigned. The inventive "atc_airline=" line containing the registration number, was ignored by ATC.

Dan
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