Tornado Launched |
Post Reply | Page 12> |
Author | ||
tom burnside
P1 Joined: 31 Oct 2008 Location: portsmouth,UK Points: 868 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Posted: 20 Mar 2011 at 10:42pm |
|
Last night at around 2:30am RAF Marham Tornado GR4s were launched to Libya to attack libyan defences. Also RAF Tornados and Typhoons are going to be based in Italy so that they are closer to the no fly zone.
|
||
VulcanB2
Chief Pilot Joined: 02 Apr 2008 Points: 13365 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|
Strange that the superior Eurofighter does nothing but attend airshows, do PR and fly around not doing much.
Why isn't it out along side, or instead of, Tornado? It's supposed to be more capable? I don't think a Eurofighter anywhere has dropped or fired anything in anger? Apparently Tranche 2 is a weapons computer upgrade, but for some inexplicable reason requires a whole new airframe and we are going to scrap it? Is the weapons system the reason it hasn't seen action yet? i.e. it doesn't work, isn't installed, or isn't capable? I'll bet by the end of the Libyan deal it still won't have shot or killed anything - just flown around a bit. Don't forget who was in power when it was ordered, either. I just read several articles, whilst trying to find out if it ever fired anything in its life, that it is supposed to be stealth? Whatever! I hear its RCS rivals a 747 from the front... It doesn't even have a gun because the weight was an issue... It must rank as one of the worst MoD procurements ever, and must be up there with the cancellation of TSR2. Why didn't we just go buy Rafale, or better yet, the F-16? We are supposed to be so buddy-buddy with the US, maybe they'd give us US spec aircraft and not the export version? Best regards, Vulcan. |
||
tom burnside
P1 Joined: 31 Oct 2008 Location: portsmouth,UK Points: 868 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|
Its probably because the RAF has 136 Tornados and only 71 Typhoons.
|
||
Hot_Charlie
Chief Pilot Joined: 02 Apr 2008 Points: 1839 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|
You must've blinked. It is - the deployment of the Typhoon was covered live on the news yesterday from Coningsby. At an early stage, using stand off weapons and cruise missiles, for which we have the proven GR4 and submarines, there isn't necessarily a need for Typhoon or other (primarily) air to air assets. |
||
allardjd
Moderator in Command Joined: 02 Apr 2008 Location: Florida - USA Points: 4506 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|
I state this as a question, not a fact...
Doesn't the Tornado have a more flexible air-ground capability than the Typhoon?
|
||
John Allard
|
||
papeg
Chief Pilot Joined: 25 Mar 2009 Location: CA Points: 1434 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|
I'm not sure but I think the main difference in ground support is that the Tornado has the 27mm guns whereas the Typhoon doen't have any guns. My source is Wiki but I'm not sure how much you can rely on what you find on Wiki.
|
||
Greg
|
||
RossUK1
P1 Joined: 02 Apr 2008 Location: East Sussex Points: 567 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|
Vulcan,
The Typhoon is primarily an air-air platform and unless I'm mistaken Libya is hardly a threat in that arena. Also, The Typhoon does have an internal gun (1 × 27 mm Mauser BK-27 Revolver cannon with 150 rounds) as far as I was aware. Ross From reading a bit further it appears maybe only Tranche 1 aircraft have the cannon, not that it makes much difference in this case whether to deploy the Typhoon to Libya (which they have anyway) |
||
RossUK1
P1 Joined: 02 Apr 2008 Location: East Sussex Points: 567 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|
John, Yes your right, the Tornado is far more capable than an unproven Typhoon in air-ground. Infact, the Tornado is one of the best strike platforms in the world - also I dont think the Typhoon is cleared to launch Storm Shadows yet - but I may be wrong about this. |
||
MartinW
Moderator in Command Joined: 31 Mar 2008 Location: United Kingdom Points: 26722 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|
that it is supposed to be stealth?
The Typhoon isn't designated a stealth aircraft. Although there were measures taken to reduce its radar cross section especially at the front.
|
||
allardjd
Moderator in Command Joined: 02 Apr 2008 Location: Florida - USA Points: 4506 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|
Not sure if the crux of this discussion has turned to Typhoon-bashing or if it's an intelligent discussion of the assets being used in Libya. Assuming the latter, I don't think radar cross section is going to be much of an issue for very long in that theatre, if at all. If it goes anything like it did in the protracted no-fly situation in Iraq, anything that emanates a search or lock signal is going to get a guided weapon headed its way pretty quickly. Low RCS is mainly important when facing a robust, effective AA capability and/or when air supremacy has not been established. Barring that, it really doesn't mean all that much. It's never a bad thing to have, but isn't always vital either.
|
||
John Allard
|
||
papeg
Chief Pilot Joined: 25 Mar 2009 Location: CA Points: 1434 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|
Agreed John, usually one of the first targets are the radars. I assume that is the case in this campaign as well and that Libya's radars have all been taken out of service.
Greg
|
||
Greg
|
||
MartinW
Moderator in Command Joined: 31 Mar 2008 Location: United Kingdom Points: 26722 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|
I think it's just more Vulcan style entertainment John. I especially like the cross section of a 747 bit.
|
||
allardjd
Moderator in Command Joined: 02 Apr 2008 Location: Florida - USA Points: 4506 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|
How does the RCS of the Typhoon compare with the Tornado or the Harrier (I know the latter have been removed from the inventory)?
Better, I suspect, even though it may not be strictly classified as a stealthy aircraft.
|
||
John Allard
|
||
dodgy-alan
Chief Pilot Joined: 16 May 2008 Location: bognor regis Points: 2994 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|
This incident is sounding more and more like the Suez Crisis all over again, only this time we havn't got any carriers, Royal Navy strike aircraft or Canberra bombers. The only reason we finished up with Typhoon was because we would have incurred massive penalties for pulling out of the programme once we had committed to it. There are many, myself included, who think we should have gone for the F16 or F18 when they first became availiable, We could even have got the Saab Gripen which was being marketed by BAe at the time with a view to licence production. Currently one of the best aircraft in the Libyan ToO at the moment is the Rafale which is A, very much a current superfighter and B, CAN operate in both A2A and GA roles with equal ease. Typhoon is good, but its not as good as the RAF had hoped. It is however still better than the Tornado F3 which was always a compromise.
|
||
The light at the end of the tunnel is a freight train coming the other way !
|
||
allardjd
Moderator in Command Joined: 02 Apr 2008 Location: Florida - USA Points: 4506 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|
Your friends do. So do the French. |
||
John Allard
|
||
MartinW
Moderator in Command Joined: 31 Mar 2008 Location: United Kingdom Points: 26722 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|
Better, I suspect, even though it may not be strictly classified as a stealthy aircraft.
A lot better, measures were taken to reduce its radar cross section especially at the front.
|
||
allardjd
Moderator in Command Joined: 02 Apr 2008 Location: Florida - USA Points: 4506 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|
Vulcan, maybe you should read more carefully before responding. |
||
John Allard
|
||
Marmite
Chief Pilot Joined: 11 Apr 2008 Points: 1029 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|
Surely a contender for post of the day |
||
MartinW
Moderator in Command Joined: 31 Mar 2008 Location: United Kingdom Points: 26722 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|
Just heard on the news, that Tornado's were about to bomb Gadaffi's compound, but they had to call it off due to the presence of civilians.
|
||
hurricanemk1c
First Officer Joined: 04 Apr 2008 Location: Portlaoise, ROI Points: 441 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|
I am missing the point slightly (sometimes do!) but surely laser-guided bombs *should* be able to hit Gadaffi's compound with minimum/no civilian loss.Is it just a too greater risk?
Also, how are the 'rebels' civilans? They have anti-aircraft cannons (3x 20mm radar guided from a photo in the paper here), MiG-23's, tanks, rocket launchers etc. Not very civil if you ask me.
Just my two cents/pence/what ever Libyans have
|
||
|
||
Post Reply | Page 12> |
Tweet
|
Forum Jump | Forum Permissions You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot create polls in this forum You cannot vote in polls in this forum |